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Author Topic: Assembly of God Position on Election  (Read 6510 times)

Offline me again

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« Reply #15 on: September 26, 2008, 08:49:07 AM »
Quote from: John Oscar;42439
It's not the idea that God can cast people into Hell that bothers a Christian with a biblical (not a taught theological) mindset.  It's not what the bible teaches about the character of God.  I've said it before and I'll say it again (cause I'm at the firehouse and my wife isn't here to swing the 2x4)- Calvinism depicts a God different from what the bible describes Him as.

Calvin's god- A capricious entity that has little or no regard for his creation.  Really the cross was unnecessary because he's just going to do what he is going to do.  He's god, and he can change his mind and character whenever he wants.  All of the scriptures in the bible about God being a loving and forgiving father that desperately wants all to come to repentance and salvation are a lie at best and a cruel deception at worst because he cares only about "his elect".

Arminius' God- A loving entity that created mankind in His image- the ability to choose, to reason, to discover Him both on a spiritual and intellectual level.  Reason and logic helps us discover Him for who he is through His revealed Word and the guiding of His Holy Spirit.

I know this is a debate that will go on until Rapture, but it's one I can never let go because it deals with the character of the one I love....
A mamma bear is fiercely loyal to her cubs; and she won't "go to bat" for the offspring of other animals. Mamma bear knows exactly who is who. :madgrin:

The Lord is fiercely loyal to His chosen elect; and he won't "go to bat" for the non-elect who are the spiritual offspring of the devil. The Lord knows exactly who is who. :eek:
"So then, stand firm and hold to the traditions :o which you were taught by us, either by word of mouth or by letter" (2 Thessalonians 2:15).

Offline Zaph

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Re: Assembly of God Position on Election
« Reply #16 on: September 26, 2008, 12:00:16 PM »
I'm not trying to be mean here but what does that have to do with anything?

To say that God created evil is saying God created suffering and desires that some experience it.

It would even say that the Lord cried "crocodile tears" when He cried over Jerusalem and please don't try to tell me that He cried over the buildings in the city and not the people who would be lost.

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Luk 13:34  O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, which killest the prophets, and stonest them that are sent unto thee; how often would I have gathered thy children together, as a hen doth gather her brood under her wings, and ye would not!
 

Quote
Eze 33:11  Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?

I suppose that the Lord was just using filler words for the Bible when He said that He desires that the wicked turn from their way and live? Why would He even have this desire if He created them to be lost or that He created them to purposely hurt other people?

Do you really only see yourself as some kind of created robot who has no choice?

Offline John Oscar

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Re: Assembly of God Position on Election
« Reply #17 on: September 26, 2008, 12:09:35 PM »
I just realized something- Calvin's description of his god exactly fits how Muslims see allah.....
John O


Offline John Oscar

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Re: Assembly of God Position on Election
« Reply #18 on: September 26, 2008, 12:17:49 PM »
Quote from: me again;42434
Here's the fact that horrifies most non-Calvinists: Most people will go to hell and there is nothing that you or they can do about it!  


:smack:

Your right!  I don't know why I never saw this before....

Sunday morning I'm announcing to our church that all mission's giving and evangelistic outreachs are hearby cancelled.  It makes absolutely no sense to put people and money in harms way when God is going to chose whomever he wants anyway irregardless of our efforts....

Actually, since we are eternally secure anyway, church makes no sense at all....we might as well sleep in on Sundays....

Like Zaph, I'm not trying to be a jerk, but Calvinists refuse to acknowelge the logical implications of what they espouse.
John O


Offline Zaph

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Re: Assembly of God Position on Election
« Reply #19 on: September 26, 2008, 10:28:20 PM »
Quote from: John Oscar;42443
I just realized something- Calvin's description of his god exactly fits how Muslims see allah.....

Wow...now that is interesting. I'm not trying to start a fight here but I am sincerely interested hearing your thoughts on that fleshed out a little more when you have time.

Offline John Oscar

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Re: Assembly of God Position on Election
« Reply #20 on: September 27, 2008, 07:08:50 PM »
Without getting into the differences in the two major divisions of Islam, Sunni and Shia, they basically believe-

allah is supreme.  he is god, almighty and unknowable.  his will is a mystery, and salvation is granted to whom he deems worthy.  There is no clearly defined system or way to win or earn your salvation other than jihad related martyrdom.  Your average Muslim has no idea of his eternal destiny, and only hopes he is one of allah's elect.

That's the basics of it.  CARM has some good articles on Islam and comparative religion.  If you google Ahmed Dedeet, you will find one of Islam's best apologists (which isn't saying much, as I've found most of his arguments against biblical Christianity can be easily refuted).
John O


eegles2003

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Re: Assembly of God Position on Election
« Reply #21 on: September 30, 2008, 10:20:18 PM »
then what  do you do with God doesnt want anyone to perish,  but calls every man to repentance.

 

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