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Author Topic: Flawed Logic?  (Read 6929 times)

Offline Quasar

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Re: Flawed Logic?
« Reply #15 on: December 10, 2007, 08:11:52 AM »
Good post, Kevin.  Proof of your logic can be found in the fact that Satan will be chained and locked up in the Abyss, for the entire Millennial reign of Christ, here on the earth, in Rev.20:1-3 and vs 6.  To eliminate the temptation that comes from him during that entire period of time.

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Quasar
"I am the way and the truth and the life.  No one comes to the Father except by me."  Jn.14:6.

kevingaily

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Re: Flawed Logic?
« Reply #16 on: January 27, 2008, 10:15:31 PM »
Quote from: Zaph;41208
I have to disagree with this logic. Because this now gives an excuse for (to) sin. We all know that temptation itself is not a sin but yielding to it is a sin. Eve choose to sin. I understand that the logic in the above statement is that she would not have sinned if she had not been tempted. But when we look at Lucifer's experience in Heaven we have to ask which came first? Temptation or sin?

However, I guess a calvinist would say that she didn't have a choice because she was ordained to sin. When choice is removed love is also removed.

There is no excuse. Please forgive me if I was not clear. What I am saying is in the absence of temptation, while in perfection, Eve was just fine.  We don't understand what that means since we are so corrupt, but Eve was blameless up to the point she was deceived.

Also, Eve was deceived; Satan was not deceived. He(Satan) knowingly knew full well and rebelled.  We can't use both in an analogy for this very reason.

This fall of humanity gave us this cursed sin nature. Eve did not have that originally. So I am by no means saying one should use what I said and run with it.

In fact, if anyone was the loser, it was Adam. He knew better, and still did evil. I feel he was guilty of the greater wrong.

Offline John Oscar

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Re: Flawed Logic?
« Reply #17 on: January 28, 2008, 06:02:18 AM »
Quote from: kevingaily;41609
In fact, if anyone was the loser, it was Adam. He knew better, and still did evil. I feel he was guilty of the greater wrong.


Adam failed in his stewardship of Eve, his wife.  A close look at Genesis 3 shows that he was there throughout her temptation, yet did nothing.
John O


Offline Zaph

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Re: Flawed Logic?
« Reply #18 on: January 28, 2008, 05:08:37 PM »
Quote from: kevingaily;41609
Also, Eve was deceived; Satan was not deceived. He(Satan) knowingly knew full well and rebelled.  We can't use both in an analogy for this very reason.


I know that this is not the point of this topic but I have to disagree that we can't compare the two. Satan was also at one point just as innocent as Eve. All I'm saying that is there is a choice. Even without Satan there to tempt her, she could have chose to disobey.

kevingaily

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Re: Flawed Logic?
« Reply #19 on: January 29, 2008, 07:32:07 AM »
Quote from: John Oscar;41611
Adam failed in his stewardship of Eve, his wife.  A close look at Genesis 3 shows that he was there throughout her temptation, yet did nothing.


Not only did he fail in his stewardship,  but also ate. A double whammy!

kevingaily

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Re: Flawed Logic?
« Reply #20 on: January 29, 2008, 07:34:18 AM »
Quote from: Zaph;41617
I know that this is not the point of this topic but I have to disagree that we can't compare the two. Satan was also at one point just as innocent as Eve. All I'm saying that is there is a choice. Even without Satan there to tempt her, she could have chose to disobey.

Noone deceived Satan, he made a conscience choice, Eve was deceived. In fact she was decieved by Satan who willfully chose to rebel.

If her decision was just as bold a rebellion as Satan, I think she may have ended up as him... no second chance.  The fact that God had mercy on her but not Satan seems to support my conclusion, but again, I'm just pondering things. I was not actually there, lol :D

Offline me again

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Re: Flawed Logic?
« Reply #21 on: January 29, 2008, 07:28:24 PM »
Quote from: kevingaily;41621
Noone deceived Satan, he made a conscience choice, Eve was deceived. In fact she was decieved by Satan who willfully chose to rebel.

If her decision was just as bold a rebellion as Satan, I think she may have ended up as him... no second chance.  The fact that God had mercy on her but not Satan seems to support my conclusion, but again, I'm just pondering things. I was not actually there, lol :D
It will be interesting to see who is saved and who is unsaved in the end of the world.  It seems clear that Cain isn't saved and Able was saved -- but we just assumed that both Adam & Eve were saved.  I'm inclined to believe that they both were saved, but I have no proof.
"So then, stand firm and hold to the traditions :o which you were taught by us, either by word of mouth or by letter" (2 Thessalonians 2:15).

 

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