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Author Topic: Is there a common denominator in these verses?  (Read 1966 times)

Offline Catalyst

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Is there a common denominator in these verses?
« on: August 05, 2012, 03:52:37 PM »
1Jo 1:2   and the life was manifested, and we have seen and testify and proclaim to you the eternal life, which was with the Father and was manifested to us—
1Jo 1:3   what we have seen and heard we proclaim to you also, so that you too may have fellowship with us; and indeed our fellowship is with the Father, and with His Son Jesus Christ.
1Jo 1:4   These things we write, so that our joy may be made complete.
1Jo 1:5   This is the message we have heard from Him and announce to you, that God is Light, and in Him there is no darkness at all.
1Jo 1:6   If we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth;
1Jo 1:7   but if we walk in the Light as He Himself is in the Light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin.
1) the desire of the author is?
2) the goal of the letter is?
3) the message to get to the goal of the letter is?
4) the thing to escape is?
5) "as he does".... if you walk in the light as He does, how complete would that be?

Eph 4:3 until we all attain to the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a mature man, to the measure of the stature which belongs to the fullness of Christ. 14  As a result, we are no longer to be children, tossed here and there by waves and carried about by every wind of doctrine, by the trickery of men, by craftiness in deceitful scheming;

1) mature man/ also perfect man, depending on translation.  Accurate in the 1611 context, and indeed American English context up until a hundred years ago or so, then it adopted a Utopian aspect to it that doesn't convey the meaning of the Greek.
2) How mature?
3)  If Christ's maturity was measured in how full a glass is, our glass would be that full. 
4)  If Christ's maturity was measured in how big that full glass was, ours would be the same size.
5)  In case we missed the analogy, it's written to the fullness of Christ.
6)  Do you believe you can be as Spiritually mature as Christ was on this earth, in your lifestyle, not in title?

If not, why not?
If so, why so?

Offline me again

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Re: Is there a common denominator in these verses?
« Reply #1 on: August 07, 2012, 10:23:20 AM »
Do you believe you can be as Spiritually mature as Christ was on this earth, in your lifestyle, not in title?

John 14:12

I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.


"So then, stand firm and hold to the traditions :o which you were taught by us, either by word of mouth or by letter" (2 Thessalonians 2:15).

Offline Catalyst

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Re: Is there a common denominator in these verses?
« Reply #2 on: August 07, 2012, 07:25:48 PM »
Ok, do you apply that to their lifestyle, or their spiritual maturity or both?  It could be either, or both as worded....?

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Re: Is there a common denominator in these verses?
« Reply #3 on: August 08, 2012, 12:17:11 PM »
Jesus raised the dead, healed the sick, walked on water, stopped storms, cast out devils, fed over 5000 people with a couple of fish, and did many other miracles. Before He comes, the Body of Christ will exceed what He did in the earth when He was here -- according to His own words. When Jesus returns, He will find His Church walking in victory and not in defeat. When Paul was in prison, he was still victorious over the devil.
"So then, stand firm and hold to the traditions :o which you were taught by us, either by word of mouth or by letter" (2 Thessalonians 2:15).

Offline Quasar

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Re: Is there a common denominator in these verses?
« Reply #4 on: August 13, 2012, 10:14:57 AM »
IMO I don't really think Jesus meant we would be doing all the things you alluded to that were unique to Him, as the Son of God, me again.

For example, there is no one who has ever been equipped with the wisdom, knowledge and power of God that Jesus has, as recorded in 1 Cor.1:24 and Col.2:2-3.  In other words, the Holy Spirit does not give any single one of us all the gifts He gives to us all, but not the same ones to everyone.

Also, according to Eph.2:10, "For we are God's workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do."  NIV.


Quasar

"I am the way and the truth and the life.  No one comes to the Father except by me."  Jn.14:6.

Offline Catalyst

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Re: Is there a common denominator in these verses?
« Reply #5 on: August 13, 2012, 11:52:32 PM »
Jesus raised the dead, healed the sick, walked on water, stopped storms, cast out devils, fed over 5000 people with a couple of fish, and did many other miracles. Before He comes, the Body of Christ will exceed what He did in the earth when He was here -- according to His own words. When Jesus returns, He will find His Church walking in victory and not in defeat. When Paul was in prison, he was still victorious over the devil.

Ok, I will accept ambiguity and evasion as an answer.

Offline Catalyst

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Re: Is there a common denominator in these verses?
« Reply #6 on: August 13, 2012, 11:56:09 PM »
IMO I don't really think Jesus meant we would be doing all the things you alluded to that were unique to Him, as the Son of God, me again.

For example, there is no one who has ever been equipped with the wisdom, knowledge and power of God that Jesus has, as recorded in 1 Cor.1:24 and Col.2:2-3.  In other words, the Holy Spirit does not give any single one of us all the gifts He gives to us all, but not the same ones to everyone.

Also, according to Eph.2:10, "For we are God's workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do."  NIV.


Quasar

Unfortunately for our image, I agree with most of what you said.  I would push you to explain the john 17 prayers, that we be in them, the same as jesus was in HIM, and tell me how that would be less?  And in ephesians, how as absolutely as spiritually mature as He was on earth, would allow us to be less.  Please don't presume to know my beliefs, I'm dealing with the scripture, not my hunches, and what you think/how you answer might affect my faith.

Offline Quasar

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Re: Is there a common denominator in these verses?
« Reply #7 on: August 16, 2012, 10:56:17 AM »
You can push all you like and understand there is nothing in it that tells us of certain capabilities Jesus was equipped with as the Son of God anyone will ever do greater than He did are:

1: Raising people from the dead.

2.  Forgiving people their sins.

3.. Giving/baptizing people with the Holy Spirit.

4.  Healing the blind, the deaf, ALS, MS and all other incurable diseases.

5.  Read the minds and thoughts of others.

6.  Have the power within to heal anyone of their infirmities who simply touch us.

And many more!


Quasar
"I am the way and the truth and the life.  No one comes to the Father except by me."  Jn.14:6.

 

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